Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

[Ellis]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

Sewer Snakes weapon motor is subject to a 75:1 reduction. I reckon if you test it early stages and it can lift 20 kg's (fast) the it will be effective. Its got to be fast and furious, if its to behave like Sewer Snakes.

That's the thing. The motor is by no means huge. Just compared a Speed 900 to the motor we have, a 900 is about a cm longer, and it weighs about 200g more. The output shaft on our motor is 5mm, I think.

It would probably be possible to do, actually. If we had to. Quite a lot of $$$ though.

We did some tests as you saw in the videos, and it didn't seem to struggle at all. It lifted about 5-6kg on a 7inch bar without the further 4:1 reduction on a bad battery when we first got the drill, which would suggest it'll do around 20kgs.

We shall see! We haven't completely ruled out buying a drive motor for a bigger robot as a way to do it. This will lift a FW, I'm quite confident of that, it's when it lifts itself+another machine (which will happen quite a lot I think) that we may struggle.

[PJ-27]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

Matt Maxham the guy that built Sewer Snake is a really friendly guy. I emailed him a while back because I wanted to make a similar robot, but that's yet to happen.
I think he's also on this forum, but not very active.

I take it you've seen this vid?:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pt6_dXKwQYw

[Ellis]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

Yes, I had seen it. I love how rugged it is. We're trying to do the same. Precision isn't our thang (in that we can't really have it, lol).

Been a while since we made progress, and MMM is suddenly REALLY SOON so we're going to try and crack on and finish now. We didn't do much tonight, made a Swiss-cheese style piece of HDPE with a total of 13 holes in it! Should do the trick though, it's to do with mounting the lifter motor.

We haven't gone ahead and finalised the lifter motor position yet as it's probably best to get the actual lifty bit built first. To do that we need scoop material. It's on a shallow angle so about 4mm steel would be great, but it may be impossible. Assuming we can source some locally, it may simple be too heavy. In which case 10mm HDPE might do. For the UK champs most likely not, but for MMM where I believe the competition won't be quite as lethal it could get us out of trouble. Better on the lifter motor too; lighter.

Mentioning that, the lifter gearbox is a 2-speed and so it has a sliding plastic ring gear inside. We fear it will fail, as we're over-volting and putting massive stresses through it. It's quite a complicated shape. It's similar to this: click - any idea if we could get such a thing made out of stronger material? And if so, where? If anyone can suggest a company we'll love you for ever and ever!

[PJ-27]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

I believe one of the gearbox settings doesn't use that ring, but which one I can't remember...... Pretty sure it's the low range.
If you're using the high then don't worry about it. If you're using low then do....

[psycho_fling]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

without knowledge and the access to the correct machines it would be hard to replicate that, and you wanted someone to do it say out of ali it is doable looking at that picture but looks very time consuming->expensive

[Ellis]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

Yes we're using the low range, and so it comes into play. I don't think the thing will have the grunt on the higher speed, and even if it did (in fact it won't I am certain) it would make the lifter move at some 300rpm which would be impossible to control. :P

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That is what I had feared. I hoped it might be a model-it-up-and-make-it-up type thing for the right company. I mean it was made out of plastic, I don't know how, but if it was machine made then surely the same machines could handle something like ali? We may be able to find spares, and it may be absolutely fine, so we're not completely stuffed. Worst comes to very worst we use a better suited motor, though that would be expensive and set us back in progress quite a bit.

As before, if anyone knows of a company that might be able to do that sort of thing, please share.

[Max]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

Looking at it, it should be fairly easy to cast meaning you could get it make it from iron, steel or aluminium if you can find a company which does casting. I know that hpc gears (I think that's their name) do inside out gears with the teeth on the inside. If you can find one with the same pitch then you could use that (unlikely I know). Also does it mesh with plastic or metal gears, if plastic then they may stip if you replace that part with metal.

[Ellis]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

Meshes with metal gears. It's the only plastic component. Interesting that you say casting. I hadn't really considered it as I didn't think casts could get that precise, could they?

Just looked at its exact role in the gearbox and I'm not confident exactly, but no longer convinced it will fail. It has 2-3 teeth from 5 gears that are about 8mm wide meshing with it at all times. For it to strip, they would all have to strip through at the same time. That's a heck of a lot of material to push through, isn't it? And I mean, it's in pretty good condition, and this drill was found in a battered way at the dump. It clearly had some hard use before we got to it. If it were a weak point I'd expect to see more in the way of deterioration.

It is in the second of 3 stages, meaning it's not under the major stress of the last stage. It might just be okay. I guess we have to build it and then find out! (joy!)

I'll look into casting possibilities. Thanks.

[MikeNCR]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

Looks like the gear selector in the 18v Dewalts I use in Nyx. Assuming similar quality/strength, I'm not sure it'll be a huge issue, as I was snapping the x-spline shafts on the Dewalts before I put a torque limiter on the weapon drive, which means it was handling some pretty high shock loads, as the shaft was supposedly capable of handling a load of 120ft-lb.

[Ellis]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

Looks like the gear selector in the 18v Dewalts I use in Nyx. Assuming similar quality/strength, I'm not sure it'll be a huge issue, as I was snapping the x-spline shafts on the Dewalts before I put a torque limiter on the weapon drive, which means it was handling some pretty high shock loads, as the shaft was supposedly capable of handling a load of 120ft-lb.

Well that's both comforting and worrying at the same time! Nice to know the nylon rings have some guts, not particularly nice to know the shaft of the thing might be at risk :P ... By the way, do you have any footage of Nyx flipping itself about? I'm interested to see more of it. Beautiful looking machine!

We just made up our chain tensioner, and we're heading out to get a 20mm metal drill bit. Going to be expensive.

Thanks all.

[SamO]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

Couldn't you put a ring form the dewalt in your drill? It might work

[Ellis]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

Sadly it's probably very unlikely they'd be a match. ^

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Pretty big progress today, we have built the basic components of the lifter (save a movement limit or two). You can start to see it now! Pictures - http://s1088.photobucket.com/albums/i32 ... menta 2/

[PJ-27]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

Looking good!

[MikeNCR]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

I've got a video of some spike testing here- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9MLRGWG5nE

The first event with the torque limiter and the spike is in a few weeks, so more video will be coming soon.

[Ellis]

Re: Tormenta 2 - Build Diary

I've got a video of some spike testing here- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9MLRGWG5nE

The first event with the torque limiter and the spike is in a few weeks, so more video will be coming soon.

Look forward to it! Looks like the machines will have similar power on the arm(s).

Well I am hoping to sell my PS3 to free up enough money for an upgrade to ESCheap85s. Would be really nice if we can do it. We need to get a new ESC for the lifter anyway so one of the drive's Electronize would go into that, giving us a spare.

Can anyone promise me it'll be worth it? I mean, it's double the cost of just another 30a Electronize, and if we want to get to an event to compete with the thing at all we need to save as much as we can. My gut says it's worth it, but it would be nice to hear it from someone who has them already!

Thanks.