Lithium cell tests

[ady]

Lithium cell tests

i know nothing about these batteries etc.. but what i dont get is why more than one robot need to test these batteries to start with? or why dont these robots go through rigerous testing/whiteboards behind closed doors?, at the end of the day it seems someone has spend alot of time researching and testing these for everyone elses benefit as well as their own, but i dont believe they should be used at uk champs!! why not a less important competition? if they were in the rules then fair enough, but due to whats at stake for the winner is this really the place for tryouts? what would peoples opinion be or how would you feel going out to one of these robots in the semis? or seeing one of these win the title.what needs clarifying, is their an unfair advantage, i dont have the answer sorry! just my opinion

[woody]

Lithium cell tests

what needs clarifying, is their an unfair advantage


Ady ...The batteries in question are very light compared to NiCads of the same rating.
The testing Robots will have no advantage because ... I assume ...they have changed their original batteries for A123 technology on a more or less like for like basis....So theyll just be a little lighter than there original weight.

[typhoon_driver]

Lithium cell tests

I am prepared to leave this topic alone if I hear the from the roboteers involved that they will not be using the extra weight gained from these cells to modify their machines. In other words, replacing the robots current batteries in a like for like swap.

John we have heard this from you already and I thank you.

Please dont get me wrong, I am exceptionally grateful to the teams involved in testing the new cells if they benefit the entire community but as Adrian says, what needs clarifying, is their an unfair advantage

[maddox]

Lithium cell tests

To be honnest.
Terrorhurtz would be disadvantaged by the loss of weight. But nothing to be overcome by some ballast in non crusial places like in the center of the robot.

It becomes unfair if everybody else isnt allowed to use Lithium based batteries, and the weightgain is used to enhance offensive or defensive capacity.

***Removed for confidential reasons.***

(Message edited by maddox on August 15, 2007)

[ian_humphrey]

Lithium cell tests

Heres an interesting video showing how much safer the A123 cells are

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9ayuFBDrSghttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9ayuFBDrSg

[geeza]

Lithium cell tests

Ok, about time someone brought logic into the argument. If people are allowed to use these batteries in any main competition when the arent in the rules, then they should have a lower weight limit to everyone else. If a robot has the same voltage (give or take a bit) then it is a straight deduction from the 100kg with difference in th pack weight. If they are running a higher voltage, then the weight of the lightest battery setup at that voltage which is allowed in the rules is taken from the robot weight before the trial batteries are added.
So if you had 9kg of nicads say, then 100-9 is 91, and 2kg of lithiums then the robot weight limit should be 93kgs.

Personally I think these batteries do need testing under high stress conditions. Specs can tell us what a battery should do under normal circumstances, what we do with them is not anywhere near normal. I dont mind either way, wether they are allowed in the UK champs or not, but if they are then something like I have suggested should be worked out.

It is upto the FRA to make a decision on this but the outcome must be fair to all.

[leorcc]

Lithium cell tests

I for one think that is a fair way of handling it.

[maddox]

Lithium cell tests

Pure balast would do fine according to me.
Just a block of something in the middle of the robot so it doesnt add anything to offensive or defensive capacities.


As I already stated.

Using the weight gained by the non allowed test batteries for anything else than balast is pure foul play if and possible abuse of power/influence you ask me.
Like quadrupling Ah stored.

[andy_kane]

Lithium cell tests

It seems some folks are getting hot under the collar about the thought of Kan-opener useing A123 cells in the UK champs.

Our A123 system will not be ready for use in the UK Champs

A decision was made a couple of weeks ago that to use these cells in the UK champs would not be a good one.

Kan-opener is reliable with its existing batteries and reliability is a key to getting on in a competition such as the UK champs.

Our team had already tested an improvement in performance with the existing system.

[leorcc]

Lithium cell tests

Thank you for the clarification Andy.

[beast]

Lithium cell tests

happy biding woody (i want out bid you

[beast]

Lithium cell tests

are these bosch batterys the same ?36v
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/36v-2ah-bosch-battery_W0QQitemZ160160277954QQihZ006QQcategoryZ12 2840QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItemhttp://cgi.ebay.co.uk/36v-2ah-bosch-...QihZ006QQcateg oryZ122840QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[woody]

Lithium cell tests

Cheers John,
I want to make a spare pack for my Feather.

I doubt if the Bosche use the SAME A123 batteries...probably similar.

Edit :- Ah! .....Some info ....

http://www.contractortoolsandsupplies.com/past/power_tools/LithiumIonLowdown.htmhttp://www.contractortoolsandsupplie...IonLowdown.htm

(Message edited by woody on September 22, 2007)

[terrorhurtz]

Lithium cell tests

Its not clear what batteries Bosch use, but they are not A123 cells.

[craig_anto]

Lithium cell tests

so are we allowed to use them now or not?