Build Rules 2011

[xtreme]

Re: Build Rules 2011

How cant you find boner exciting? Damage and impact were 2 of the most exciting things about robot wars, boner covers both of them.
Using boner as an example, look at the reaction you get from the roboteers and crowd watching when boner hits another robot smashing it up into the air and throwing robots out of the arena, Thats a reaction you dont get when its a box on the offensive.

[ady]

Re: Build Rules 2011

tom please, you dont need to explain to me what i find an exciting robot. You own one of my old machines of course. I said before i'm more interested in how far my robot gets than how much i please a crowd as im personally not the E.O. If im watching then yes i wanna see damage, mayhem etc... but im also talking from a competing point of view, i aint their to please a crowd, they dont pay my build or repair costs. I have watched all the vids of the event on youtube numerous times and it did nothing for me. I like to fight a robot that has a great risk of smashing me up.

from the vids i watched i found it not exciting (boring is a bit harsh), it was limiting on damage. it looks very creative and unique looking so fair play for gary for his creativeness, looks nice but that doesnt mean i found it exciting to watch. i saw damage to hdpe but my 5mm steel electric lifting wedge would push it all over the place with ease in my opinion.

Exciting is LS4,360,hornet,Savage evo to name a few. any robot that stands up to these is also exciting for me whether its a box, flipper

is their a problem to voicing your opinions on another robot on this forum??

you obviously never heard the reaction when my wedge hit hornet full on and ended up with hornet out the arena or being hit by ls2 numerous times before pushing it in the pit.I have a vids of these somewhere if interested in hearing the crowd shouting pit! pit! pit!

Wedges are boring when theirs alot in one fight, i understand that. But also alot of flippers is aswell. it would be good to hear what so called box owners think on this.

this event was very bad timing for me as well as way too far, (baby on the way etc......) hopefully at robochallenges next event i will prove my point that wedges are worthy competitors, mine has a electric lifter but thats for my advantage not a crowd pleaser.
i have gone back to a reliable old design but added a electric lifter as all i want to do is win, nothing else otherwise i wouldnt of sold u savage evo

[typhoon_driver]

Re: Build Rules 2011

i'm more interested in how far my robot gets than how much i please a crowd

We have very different aims at a competition

[banana_man]

Re: Build Rules 2011

As someone who has only built boxes so far, I would say that, for excitement against a destructive weapon, boxes are a good choice. By their very nature, boxes (mine seem be exceptions) are usually very solid and reasonably cheap, meaning that their drivers have less of an issue driving straight in to a spinner, thus creating lots of noise and pretty sparks. I personally, especially in whiteboards, love to see my robot smacking into a spinner, because I have built it so that the expensive bits are untouchable (touch wood), and love to see the carnage, even if it does result in the utter mullering it took from Boner at the champs. The beauty of a box is that it's simplicity means that you can repair it quite easily after a big spinner hit, and throw it in again almost straight away, meaning that there is more damage and spectacle for the audience. So basically my argument is; don't take action to reduce the number of boxes, or ban them, as they make nice cannon fodder.

[ady]

Re: Build Rules 2011

and thats fine gary, my comments mite sound selfish but i always help to pack up at the end of event and their is plenty that dont. Im sure theirs a few that think like me, one that springs to mind is hypnodisc vs dominator 2, the crowd were booing as they held back but did hypnodisc care? i doubt it...

i spose storm 2 against typhoon was all about pleasing the crowd their was more running away than anything, im sure winning was more on your mind then :wink:

[xtreme]

Re: Build Rules 2011

Boxes can be good, At the uk champs last year and this year a few spinners have thrown themselves out of the arena, yes its exciting but its still the spinner that causes the excitement. The box isnt the one that is talked about and never gets the credit after an impact that results in a spinner flying out of the arena. And agreeing with Gary, Its not all about going just to win, if you go just to win I cant see how you can have fun. Robot wars wouldnt have lasted as long as it did if it wasnt for the entertainment value, none of the live events would still be happening if it wasnt for entertainment. If you dont please the crowd they dont come back and pay for a ticket next time, that puts an end to live events and that puts an end to having somewhere to play with our machines.
Theres always going to be boxes in the spobby because people have to start somewhere and a box is a nice safe starting point and also theres some very impressive boxes like tiny toon and alpha. I do agree with you a bit, An impressive box thats well driven can be as good to watch as any other style of robot, Like Storm II, I loved that robot in robot wars, It was one of my fave robots in robot wars, It didnt need the lifter to be awsome but because of the rules they put a lifter on it. Why cant that be done now? build a robot thats a phenominal rambot but have a weapon on it even if its not going to change your offence style.
I dont think the holding back thing is about not been botherd about pleasing the crowd, You hold back beacuse you dont want to destroy somones robot and leave them not being able to compete for the rest of the weekend and it costing them a fortune in repairs. If your opponents robot was dead and they gave you the all clear to do your worst and try smash it up then you do it, But if they dont want you to you dont, when they say stop they mean stop... if you can hear them.

[xtreme]

Re: Build Rules 2011

i spose storm 2 against typhoon was all about pleasing the crowd their was more running away than anything, im sure winning was more on your mind then :wink:

Bit unfair eh?

[ady]

Re: Build Rules 2011

no im just saying, as its not about just pleasing the crowd.. typhoon used tactics ahead of crowd pleasing to win that fight im sure, i would of done exactly the same and whatever it took to win, but it certainly wasnt a crowd pleaser in my opinion.
gary got alot further in rw's than i could possibly dream of getting (let alone on the show) and i respect him for that. Im simply pointed out a fight that questions winning from crowd pleasing. you would be mad to put pleasing the crowd ahead of winning that!! it aint a popularity contest!

if you please the crowd aswell thats good, but my main aim is winning. And if a you find a robot or type of robot boring and say it, then its fair for me to say well tbh i find yours unexciting but i wouldnt of said it otherwise.
with my spinner i would always hold back if i took someone out, i would still hold a gentlemens agreement with most roboteers.

btw hypnodisc didnt attack dominator 2 anymore as they didnt want to damage themselves!! not that they were holding back from damaging dominator 2 further. All they did was lock a wheel, they held back as they didnt want to risk their own progression in the competition, the crowd boo'd because of this but it was different when they were causing lots of damage got a lot of cheers then!.

same as footy a chelsea fan will booo and scream abuse at rooney when its chelsea v man u, but when he scores for england their cheering then!!

[cavecrusher]

Re: Build Rules 2011

As a Box-owner (BonX, for those who remember) i find the endless debate on wedges to be as boring as the wedges themselves.

A wedgebot is simply put the finest K.I.S.S. example there is.

However there is a big difference in wedgebots, on one side you have the wedge-pushers (the starting level of FW robots, using the cheap and simple drillmotors) and on the other side you have the wedge-rammers (the BonX/Tiny Toon/Alpha a-like, using high end custom drivetrains to get as much speed and torque out of the bots as possible, while having enough armor to withstand most damage).

The biggest problem I see with the current competition isn't the wedges, it's the OOTA-possibility of the arena and the amount of flippers we're running today. The occasional Pit favors the wedges, i must admit.

But face it, if you don't have a wedge/low ground-clearance, you'll get thrown out of the arena in no-time, losing the match. Spinners solve this problem with the simple reason that they hit first and harder (hoping they stay in the arena after the hit).

It's the rock-paper-scissors game, except here it's the Pusher/Spinner/Flipper/Axe/Crusher variety. Every rules-set and arena set-up will favor some design above others. Currently it's the Pusher (Pit) / Flipper (OOTA) / Spinner (Good old KE). Putting the price into the equation quickly reveals that the pusher will be the cheaper one to built...

Limiting the amount of energy in the robots (Gas of KE) and removing the PIT and OOTA from the arena will level the advantages of each robot-type, but be prepared to have some long and boring 'fights'. I think there is no ideal setup, but each setup will result in a certain equilibrium of robots. Just pick the equilibrium you like.

[john_frizell]

Re: Build Rules 2011

Two comments on the proposed 2011 rules:

1. The 3 lb weight class should be listed in the rules.
2. 27 and 40 MHz AM and FM should be allowed for feathers that do not have active weapons.

The second point is to encourage new people to enter the sport. I am well aware that 2.4 GHz gear is now as cheap as, or cheaper than 27 and 40 MHz stuff, but new entrants often build with what they have to hand or can get dead cheap.

[razerdave]

Re: Build Rules 2011

Just a quick thing on Johns point, 40MHz is fine, I've seen that used in FW's with no weapons, but I've seen 27MHz used in a feather without weapons this year, and although it was a bit slow and unlikely to hurnt anyone, the young man had virtually no control due to the amount of interferance. Its just too low in the frequency table. so 40MHz, fine, but 27MHz, bad idea.

[Bodge Job]

Re: Build Rules 2011

err, but the robot (was also so slow that it could not get to the battle!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_YxX2LuAfA
(the slow one with the antena on top)
27mhz is realy a bad idea


ps I hope this is the one your talking about.
and thaks for letting me boro your controler afterwards

[Thunder arrow]

Re: Build Rules 2011

i went to that match and it was rubbish!!!
(i went becos it is only 10mins away )
Theo

[razerdave]

Re: Build Rules 2011

I know the robot was slow Alex, but there may be people out there with new robots that are faster, running drill motors rather than wiper motors, but still on 27MHz, that could cause an injury.

[Bodge Job]

Re: Build Rules 2011

yes, 27mhz should not be alould to fight.

but what if someone spent £20 on a r/c car and glued armor on to it, could we let them fight then?