Announcement

**maddox** · 24 July 2006, 19:11

Pneumatic Rules

If we go over to 13.6kg here, then its still a full kilo we can spend more on our feathers.

On the other side, if the RFL goes over to the proposed/new limited consumables rule of 600 gram CO2 for feathers up to 2 kg in heavies, then the RFL gets also a new incentive to build pneumatical machines.

Its 600 grams free power...

But its not only the CO2 weight, or the other pressurised gasses.
In the RFL 3000 psi storage tanks are allowed, over here the limit is 1000 psi, so we all use CO2 due the favorable liquid/gas transformation.

The biggest problem is that the RFL has a serious issue with pressure tests and the prototype rule that gives us a legal way to prove our Euro materials.

Also, who cares that a robot would explode in the arena? Its not as if a bunch of spinners dont induce bigger forces.

**wazio** · 24 July 2006, 19:49

Pneumatic Rules

Now that I am trying to use a prototype cylinder I am starting to question the RFL rules... Most (all of Marios) prototype cylinders are safe as seen in all of the cylinders that you have made Mario. But I assure you the first time I fired it I was out of the room just in case. The big thing that I found out is that they,the RFL dont want a total noob trying to weld up a cylinder and kill himself. I understand this, but it puts a real damper on pneu bots. Espically with people who half way know what they are doing. The only reason we go up to 3000 psi is so we can use HPA, like I will use on skewer. . . In whatever life time I actually finish it :-). + With the free weight more pneu bots will get built, yay! Less killer spinners and brick bots = good!

~Chad :-)

**jamesb** · 24 July 2006, 19:55

Pneumatic Rules

if you take an off the shelf cylinder, and drill holes in it, it looses its certification.

if you enlarge the already made holes, it may effect its certificate.

just how much work on a cylinder/ram is allowed before it looses its certificate?

maybe you should ask the RFL this, and if it turns out that a lot of rams are actually in breach of their original certification, then prototype rules can be suggested rather than ban the current machines?

just my suggestion to help?

**woody** · 25 July 2006, 09:44

Pneumatic Rules

The big thing that I found out is that they,the RFL dont want a total noob trying to weld up a cylinder and kill himself
But the RFL , FRA etc let noobs build spinners .... potentially just as dangerous if not more so. IMHO

**grant_ploughbot** · 25 July 2006, 12:33

Pneumatic Rules

That is true, but the comment about pnuematics blowing up is not much different to spinner is not a good thing to think! Its not only going to blow in the arena, its at its maximum pressure when its been filled, I.E out in the pits, or loading into the arena. Spinners only unleash their power in the arena when they are locked in.

**maddox** · 25 July 2006, 13:04

Pneumatic Rules

Grant, it seems you dont use pneumatics. The pressure is the highest when the bottle warms up, and our rules allow only certified bottles, and I have only 1 bottle certified to 135 bar. All the others are 200 bar and above.
Also, open the bottle and the PRD has to vent any pressure over 1000 psi.
Even a low pressure valve or ram wont explode at this pressure, it just will trow out all the thin seals and vent gas as a sieve.

The only things we have seen explode with pneumatics are rams that trew the rod because the moving mass of the arm ripped it out, or the cast ali head couldnt resist the force.

And even certified hydraulic rams can suffer from this, as no ram is meant to move at the speeds we want. Festo gives as max speed for most it rams 4m/sec. Hydraulic seals ,depending on kind and brand do only 2m/sec.

Gravitys ram achived unloaded speeds over 10m/sec.

**woody** · 25 July 2006, 13:55

Pneumatic Rules

ALL certified co2 bottles that are correctly filled are perfectly safe .... A standard rupture disc is set to blow @ approx 2,200 psi .. On a correctly filled bottle this shouldnt happen until its temperature exceeds 120 degrees F ...... squeezing a little extra into the bottle e.g. 1/2 a kilo on a std 2kg bottle brings the temperature/burst disc threshold down to around 80 degrees F.
Note that bottles are/should be ONLY turned on in the Arena.

**grant_ploughbot** · 25 July 2006, 15:49

Pneumatic Rules

sorry, i miss understood then!
But i do beleive that wether the robot uses pneumatic/hydraulics/petrol engines etc etc that the robot should enter the arena within the weight limit.
Robot wars set the rules to state that gas was aloud ontop of the weight limit to encourage more people to build pneumatic weapons. but there are quite a few now.

**leorcc** · 26 July 2006, 05:10

Pneumatic Rules

That may require a lot of existing robots to loose a nice chunk of weight, and with a lot of them i know they would not make te weight then. Even now i know of one robot that is struggling to get the weight down since the rule change that only 2kg gas fillig is counted as consumable and the rest is added to the weight.

But as a compromise, why dont we let youre robot weigh in with empty batteries. hows that?

Announcement

Pneumatic Rules

Pneumatic Rules

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment