21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

[tom_kane]

In league of the next FRA meeting on the 25th of July, this is the thread in which matters for the agenda should be proposed for the Governing body to discuss. Any comments are welcome.

Thanks

[m2xt]

Re: 21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

I would propose that the following statement in the constitution is reviewed:

Currently 5.5 reads €œGoverning Body meetings shall rule on all FRA matters including guidelines and regulations for the safe and enjoyable involvement in robot build, operation and events. These meetings shall set the policy for activities of the Association and its representatives.€

This statement gives the Governing Body carte blanche to do as it feels best without consulting the wider membership. The FRA appears to no longer have the infrastructure to take technical decisions on all issues and hides behind the all too typical British justification of safety. I would like to see any changes to build rules fully considered and justified and presented to the membership along with the Governing Bodies recommendation for voting on before implementation.

Two issues that come to mind are the proposed 40MHz rule change and the ban on LiPo€™s on weights above feathers. I can see no justification in banning 40MHz and the current ban on LiPo€™s. Both technologies are fully legal and common place in the UK RC model market.

Secondly, the build rules should be reviewed by the Governing Body to ensure they are keeping pace with technology changes and are not unreasonably excluding materials or practices. The membership should also be invited to contribute to the review.

[craig_colliass]

Re: 21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

I propose

The committee considers the large number of good suggestions made by many roboteers and EO€™s in €œThe Future of Roboting€ thread, and plan actions to assist in bringing about as many as are practical to help safeguard the future of fighting robots in this country.

Thank you

Craig

[john_frizell]

Re: 21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

I agree with Paul that there is no justification in banning 40 MHz and have said so in a post elsewhere on the forum.
I'm also concerned by the open ended (ie. includes but is not resticted to) FRA code of conduct which lists hard to define offenses such as 'dishonesty towards the FRA and its members' and 'bringing the FRA or the sport of roboteering into disrepute'. I think that dishonesty, or libel/slander (bringing the FRA or the sport of roboteering into disrepute), would need to be proven in a court of law before they could be considered as misdconduct that could lead to 'Explusion from the FRA and a lifetime ban from membership' as currently provided for in the code of conduct.

[tom_kane]

Re: 21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

Thanks Paul and John, the 40MHz issue will be discussed again from matters arising from the last meeting.

The LiPo discussion is already on the agenda and so are the amendments to the constitution. Your comments will be considered.

Craig, I have also asked for a discussion on the €˜The Future of Roboting€™ with reference to your thread. I would like to take this opportunity in thanking you for starting it and generating some very interesting reading!

Any further proposals are welcomed!

Thanks

[grafix]

Re: 21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

I dont agree with banning 40Mhz radios either. I do agree with the CoC though.
I dont know enough about Lipos to make a decision.
Mike.

[pressure]

Re: 21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

Hi Guys, keep the comments coming, I will be taking a print out of them to the meeting.
Mike.

[muchalucha]

Re: 21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

Im not sure im im allowed to post here so sorry if im not .

From the future or robotting thread , it looks like most people (including me ) are against the ban of 40 mhz systems , but as a counter argument id like to say that 2.4 ghz systems are only a bit more expensive than a good 40 mhz system , so rather than ban 40 mhz systems , they could be recomended to new people just starting out in roborics .

I am in no way blaming anyone , but one thing i have noticed is that people using 2.4ghz sytems dont sufer the effects of radio interferance nearly as much as people using 40 mhz systems (i know this is a very broad statement but low volt , high amp dc motors tend to interfere with lower frequencies) , so they dont tend to put capacitors across their motors or anything like that , which is problematic for people on 40 mhz. I remember at robots live burgess hill 2009 , there was one robot making huge amounts of rf noise and my FW was going crazy .

[widow_twanky]

Re: 21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

From the future or robotting thread , it looks like most people (including me ) are against the ban of 40 mhz systems , but as a counter argument id like to say that 2.4 ghz systems are only a bit more expensive than a good 40 mhz system , so rather than ban 40 mhz systems , they could be recomended to new people just starting out in roborics .

Just because people don't say anything doesn't mean they agree with you. That discussion has been between a very limited number of vocal members. I think at last Pete seems to have bought some common sense to the debate. My opinion, Pete is right, 2.4ghz is more reliable. Does the relative unreliability of 40mhz cause safety issues? Dunno that's for people more experienced on that issue to decide. Personally only ever used it for about three events and then changed it.

Andy

[m2xt]

Re: 21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

Looking at the CoC, it generally contains what is needed because there is a need to protect the interests of the FRA as a whole and its membership. Regretfully there is a very small minority who given the chance could/would/has meet/met the misconduct examples. JF - why do you believe a court of law would be needed. As long as the FRA are not discriminating against members or potential members on the usual things such as race etc.. surely the FRA can exclude who ever it likes as no one has a right of membership. In fact I would say that the Governing Body have been a little too accommodating of the troublesome minority. Just my opinion.

[john_frizell]

Re: 21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

An additional issue to consider here is entry cost. Used 40 Mhz equipment, and 27 MHz which is also allowed for FW's, is quite cheap. There is no comparable market in used 2.4 gig equipment. Our sport needs new people to join it and so keeping 27 MHz and 40 MHz equipment an available option makes it easier for new people to join.

[muchalucha]

Re: 21st FRA Governing Body Meeting,Saturday 25th July

i am in no doubt that 2.4 ghz systems (price not being a factor) are far far superior to 40 mhz radios , but as john said , some one new to the sport is just not going to be able to aford / want to buy a full blown 2.4 ghz radio .

I know its up to higher powers to make the final decission , but can i suggest that , slowly over time , as technology moves on and 2.4 ghz technology becomes more available , 40 mhz is heavily discouraged , but not banned.