The future of roboting

[john]

Re: The future of roboting

the cost of running an event is mad, i didnt know it cost so much til jonno told me!

if we had an entry fee it would have to be closer to £100 a team, then £20 - if theres 20 teams at an event (do we get that many?) all paying £20 thats only £400, seems alot but its not much to cover the costs of the shows. and how many teams can afford nearer to £100? plus petrol at £30+/time off work etc it all adds up. we would be up for paying it but sadly not everyone would be able to afford it which means people wont attend events and will feel left out etc although any fee would help EO's but im not sure how much they would need but i would guess there sadly losing closer to 1000s then 100s

dont know whats going to happen! shane swan needs to come and save the day and im sure this will be the topic at riat

[ady]

Re: The future of roboting

if i was losing £0000's i would knock it on the head tbh. i wouldn't face severe financial loss for the fra or roboteers, sorry.
their must have been good times otherwise rr etc... would have knocked it on the head ages ago.
without it coming back on tv (which is never going to happen) I cant see how you can regenerate interest. or wait till we get out of these hard £££ times.
i guess the problem is ticket sales??
Has anyone got any ideas of what is wrong at events? or what ideas people have to regenerate interest?

the only problems i can think of

it isnt full combat (but you need alot of £££ for the arena to be up to spec, and increased transporting costs)

and we need more well known robots from the tv days, that people remember and still watch now on repeats (but cant see that happening either), i know! widow twanky needs to buy more and bring them out of retirement

i would like to see the uk champs or a world champs event run as one massive event, all eo's clubbing together, that would be a awesome event.. but unrealistic i know.

[tom_kane]

Re: The future of roboting

As a roboteer

As a relatively experienced roboteer in terms of how long I have been doing this (9 years). I have seen rooboteering go from one RW event per year and one live circuit full combat event a year to the stage we are at now.

The variety of events I can go to has greatly expanded. There are several different EOs which are providing many different types of event such as, full combat, long run championship and play or whiteboard events. Personally, I like the sociable events such as RIAT, which has always been my favourite event out of the calendar possibly with the exception of last year. This is good. Diversity wins.

In the future I see less events like this and more of what RR are doing at the moment in terms of the long-term championship, however, I do not complain. I love this sport and never see me stopping with out a really really good reason. Taking a couple of months off for my exams has quite frankly sucked and I cant wait to get out there and see all you guys again whilst pounding your robots! For the survival of robots, credit has to be given to EOs and especially Jonno because he was there from the beginning helping us but the roboteers who have stayed strong should not be forgotten.

As a governing body member

I wanted to hold this position within the FRA because I think I€™m old enough and have had enough experience in this game to start getting increasingly involved and this was my opportunity. It doesn€™t seem like much has changed since the new governing body has moved in but I€™m sure you can remember how long it took for the FRA to make a difference when it was first set up. We are all in new roles and have had 1 meeting and are therefore just settling in.

We need a figurehead and I€™m sure this will be sorted out at the next meeting.

We can do more and we will do more!

I think the forum activity has been hit because of the new forum being different and possibly confusing for some people. I must admit, I found it annoying at first, not being familiar with a phpBB forum but I believe it to have been a good move so thanks again Kane for all the hard work you put in!

I see the future being prosperous and full of robotic activity although possibly not in the same form we see it now

Thanks

Tom

[craig_anto]

Re: The future of roboting

We will be back on TV at some point soon to say we never will is an insult to those who are still trying. Even minimal exposure is better than nothing
Anything we get on tv will need to be different to what has been on before, i'm not just talking about full combat, it has to be more accessable to people, and we need to demonstrate that its accessable within the show, the format has to change and adapt to what is required, it has to be low cost but not look cheap

Tv will be more interested once we find in ourselves the new format and style.

I still prefer the old forum was much easier to follow

The FRA is facing crunch time, their facing a point where there will be less to no arena's or events, the next meeting should include the EO's

[bbrcaz]

Re: The future of roboting

A large family orientated event with age old attractions such as a circus, clowns, donkey rides ect. has been running yearly in my local town for a number of years and the independent organiser has enjoyed good attendance. However this year despite ideal weather conditions numbers were drastically down and financially it was not successful.

I don€™t expect the organisers are overly concerned as they will put this down to the current economic situation. They may well tighten their belts in the mean time but they will be safe in the knowledge that things will pickup and return to normal sooner or later.

The problem in roboteering is that there has always been an expectation that public interest will decrease as the tv shows get forgotten and there has always been a feeling that it can€™t last forever. The fact that attendance numbers are down now make people draw the conclusion that this could be the beginning of the end.

I think the reality is that the options for family days out are pretty limited and the robot shows make a novel change and people enjoy it, not necessarily because they recognise robots they have seen on tv. The event organisers have shown that with dedication the sport can float without tv.
In short, we should stop talking as if the sport is on its last legs and instead get behind the EO€™s in the efforts to entertain the paying public.

Positive suggestions:

Where ever possible promote the sport. I don€™t think I have ever spoken to someone who was not actually at a robot show who knows they go on, this shows the hard task the EO€™s face to sell tickets. The more that people promote the sport with web diary€™s, you tube videos the better.

In my opinion quick change-overs between fights is essential to keep the show momentum. My experience from sitting in the crowd and mingling outside is that the audience don€™t like the long periods between fights but thoroughly enjoy the rest of it. All us roboteers are responsible for occasional problems arming up, we could try and keep this to a minimum by refining our design and knowing our procedure.

[blazerbotics]

Re: The future of roboting

Hi All,

It€™s great to see such a debate and that the roboteers are noticing the issues affecting all Eos. Were now in our third year running our arena, and like most have seen the audience numbers falling, for example Burgess Hill this year saw less than half the numbers that it did a couple of years ago. Yes we are in the middle of a credit crunch and people don€™t have as much expendable income, but people will still seem to pay for entertainment (cinema sales have gone up over the last couple of years).

The fact the Robot Wars etc isn€™t on the mainstream channels anymore is a big factor in the drop in audiences, when it was shown on Sky 1 and Jetix it actually started to reach a new audience. Will it ever be on TV again? I€™m certain that it will, whether it be a different format or rules, I€™m sure we€™ll see fighting robots back on the TV, maybe soon, maybe not for another 10 years. TV exec€™s are running out of ideas and it seems to be almost in style at the moment to bring back shows e.g. Gladiators, Red Dwarf, Dr Who, Krypton Factor etc. The best chance is for fans/roboteers to write to channels asking to show repeats or even Battlebots/Robotica.

Should the FRA be stepping in? In a nutshell, yes. At the end of the day without events for roboteers to go to there€™s not a lot of point in it existing. What should it be doing? That ones up for discussion at the end of the day it€™s your association, you decide, maybe a good brainstorming session is in order I€™m sure we can come up with some good ideas between us. Hopefully with a new committee in place we can see the politics pushed aside and get back to the FRA€™s main objectives.

As for us, we€™ve got Reading on the calendar in October, this will be our last major event of the year and we€™re aiming to put as much as we can into it and making it a success. We€™ve tried hard to diversify our shows over the years with the inclusion of; Daleks, Mechanoids, Boxers and now Skeletron. You have to remember as well that were in a different position to other EO€™s in that this isn€™t our living and we€™ve all have full time jobs to fit it in around, which makes it more difficult for us to put in the leg work.

As you maybe aware we run at several expos/exhibitions throughout the year here we run a small arena and put on demo fights throughout the day, although these types of event are rare, the space we occupy could be sold to exhibiters for thousands of pounds so organisers much prefer to sell the space rather than paying for us to fill it. The good news for next year is we€™re already looking at dates/venues for the start of the year.

Where€™s the future of the sport going; we have seen over the years that the heavyweights are the main driving force, although the FWs are becoming more advance, when put next to the heavyweights they just don€™t pack the same punch, of course some will disagree. Middleweights may be another option but give it a few years they€™ll be at the same level as the feathers, so they would still require similar arenas to heavys. So the costs wouldn€™t be much less.

As John said, for entry fees to be make any sort of impact on the expenses of running an event you would be talking a lot of money per robot/team. We appreciate the work and expenses teams cover, the least we can do at the moment is give you an arena to play in and abit of food.

People are still interested in the sport it€™s just getting harder to find them!

[m2xt]

Re: The future of roboting

I believe that the main if not only reason that combat still takes place is down to the EO's and the remaining dedicated bot builders. The contribution from the FRA is not obvious to myself and I maintain has done little to encourage new blood. It preferred instead to focus on the international side and harmonisation before putting its own teritory on a sound footing first. Apart from a forum which let's be honest could equally have been hosted by any number of willing organisations. The FRA has I'm sure been of benefit to some EO's in staging events as the FRA could be perceived as being a creditable authority for sanctioning events / arenas but is that enough?

I have seen at first hand over the last 5 years the decline in builders buying parts, I used to ship 20-30 Bosch 750's a month, now I have discontinued them due to a lack of demand. The same goes for many other parts I used to stock for combat robot builders.

I still desire to get back to the arena, just hope there is somewhere to play once I pull my finger out.

For me, it was the technical challenge of building a bot + the social side. I have never been a fan of the camp that out sources the building, that's not to say its wrong, it's just not for me. I have to agree that the current format has probably had its day and needs a new direction or even a completely fresh start. If that fresh start provided for a fresh technical challenge then all the better for those garage builders like myself.

I really wanted to attend Rebel's full combat event, shame it was cancelled and nothing since has really got me enticed to the same degree. I just wanted to fight spinners!

In conclusion, I would want to see full combat staged again but fully understand the practicalities of why this is so difficult, not just for regulars on the circuit but for the EO's as well. I fail to see how feathers can provide the same impact for the audience as heavies but there again, I haven't been to a show in ages. Maybe Jonno will invite me to help build the arena at Portsmouth?

[ady]

Re: The future of roboting

alan that was sum really sensible reading. Hopefully notes will be taken.
Craig if we are back on mainstream tv in the next 3 years i will eat my robot.

[craig_anto]

Re: The future of roboting

i'll get u some ketchup Ady

[ady]

Re: The future of roboting

prefer brown sauce please.
i'd love to see it back as much as the next person, just cant see it happening. Even the old repeats would do me!!

[calumco]

Re: The future of roboting

ill happily bring every sauce there is! i believe theres every chance that it could one day come back. in its prime it was a massivly popular show, you could buy robotwars games, curtains, bins, pullback toys, remote control house robots, mini arena for the toys and bed sheets to name a few- i've still got mine somewhere:P so surley because it was so sucessful back then if it was to come back it would be again, mabye even more so with how much improved todays robots are it would make for even better tv. and like in the 7th war there was a special event in each episode, the first one could be ady eating his robot:P - would make for interesting t.v .

[team_orr]

Re: The future of roboting

my 2 cents...

not many people will recognize me as a event organizer, in fact, many of you will not recognize me at all (iv only been to about 5 events (not including ant events) ) but i have in fact hosted a antweight event (r.f.r.c, which stands for richmond fighting robot club) and have many more lined up for the future. the one event i have organized has been quite expensive and hard to organize (thanks to many people for helping me btw!) so i can only imagine what hosting a bigger event will be like. iv only really been active for 2 years but even in that time i have seen the sport we love change dramatically. more of the good ol' boys seem to be turning up less and less and, from my point of view only a limited amount of new blood has come in. over on the ant forum however (robotwars101) we seem to be picking up a lot of new blood and just to show what new blood can mean for the sport: in the 2 years iv been here i have had 10 ants, 2 feathers and a heavy (not to mention various other creations). if every newbie had that amount of robots we would be laughing

i have a lot more to say but i suggest you look at the bottom-ish bit of this thread
http://www.robotwars101.org/phpBB/viewt ... 3&start=15

what i suggest is teamwork, we need to get the word out there that we are still alive and kicking, perhaps if the e.o's had a joined event the cost could be shared among them?

im really not to sure about some of this stuff tbh, the money and ressesion part is more of a adult topic (i try to help out but im only 12) what i do know though is that i love robots and im not going down without a fight!

[dgr]

Re: The future of roboting

I'd be happy to pay an entry fee to any event I attend, I think that's fair.

I also think that lighter weight classes are a good way to go. They allow full on combat in a smaller space, and therefore reduce costs. Of all the events I've attended recently, I really, really enjoyed the FW Championship in Newcastle. With spinners in play, I think both the roboteers and the audience had a very exciting time, even without the awesome spectacle of the heavys.

Are people going to start building more middleweights? There are only a few around currently, but I think it only takes a few people stepping forward to build one in order for the weight catagory to start to grow...think I'll change my plans and make my planned heavy into a good middleweight instead and get the ball rolling. I know this wont help much in terms of finances ect, but the size differences and ease of transport might be a key point.

I'm wondering if comparisons to TV robot wars is doing us any favours. People come to the events expecting Hypno-Disc to tear people apart, which doesn't happen anymore. On all the flyers for RR events there's pictures of Razer or Pussycat ect, then people turn up and they are not there...I'm wondering if it would be better marketing to distance ourselves a bit more. Go for a fresh, new approach that can bring in audiences maybe?

[psychostorm]

Re: The future of roboting

An advertising campaign might work, but somehow I have the funny feeling that might cost more than it stands to gain. Though while we€™re on the topic of marketing, has anyone done a Vox Populi, yet?

Featherweights are more likely to take off in live events for their low weight, small size and general opportunity to experiment. You can actually create a disposable basic combatant or complex prototype without spending thousands of £s. In many respects, we€™ll never see a category quite like the feathers again. Though one downside for them is, as Jonno has said is size. featherweights in a heavyweight arena are a let down from the audiences perspective - you can€™t see them from a lot of angles. Jonno also stated power as a factor but I€™d argue the increase in weight is more the draw. A heavier machine makes a bigger bang - end of.

On the topic of television, I€™d like to disagree with the thought of having special events between championship fights. In fact, I€™d recommend ditching the €˜full championship event across entire season€™ format in its entirety. I reckon an Extreme style format, where multiple, smaller competitions can be run €˜simultaneously€™, would ultimately better as networks could ultimately decide what competitions would work for television - making changes to the plan rather than an outright rejection of it. Then, once that's aired, make the €˜full championship event across entire season€™ the spin-off series.

[craig_anto]

Re: The future of roboting

Extreme 1 and 2 had much lower ratings in comparison to the main competition series its not a sucsessfull option

I beleive that a series that gives a champion at the end of each episode is more likely to sucseed with a grand champion at the end of the series