FRA urgent announcement

[maddox]

FRA urgent announcement

Mr Kane, I suggest we take that out of account.
Yes, I posted only 766 times now.
Show me postings were I attack, or denigrate anyone before you accuse any futher. Or let us talk about this in privacy. No need to polute this forum with snide remarks.

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For the UK champs. Officially you were not in charge.

And still my question is not answered.

What if an organizer ignores the FRA?

[leorcc]

FRA urgent announcement

Oh and i am a paying member.

[andy_kane]

FRA urgent announcement

mario,
It is impossible to answer your question.
The governing body would make a decision on such matters. ie 10 roboteer teams approx

The FRA has imposed nothing on anybody it is the event organisers that have imposed their will on us, it may be that they are not happy with the situation but never the less they have decided that they cannot take a chance on a known safety risk.

In post 765 you also have said it is dangerous to mix spinners with fabric roofs.

The FRA working party has been on the problem since the UK champs after seeing what happened.

A mandate to do this was sought from the governing body and granted

All the working arenas have been visited, and asessed according to the 2003 guidelines and event reports reviewed.

After the above process the working group presented a document to the event organisers last Saturday for their comments, the rest is history.

I hope that clears these matters up

[simon]

FRA urgent announcement

Rather than ban spinners, or modify arenas is it possible to minimise RISK. eg do vertical spinners have more potential to make airbourne shrapnel ? could the power be reduced ?.
Might not be popular with the spinner crowd but better than scrapping machines, or rebuilding arenas in the short term.
Post 363 from a none member.

[geeza]

FRA urgent announcement

Mario to answer your question from how I see things. If an event organiser were to ignore guidelines then it could be taken that either the event organiser or the roboteer who caused an accident could be liable for damages. Assuming that they neglected to inform the insurance comapny of what they were doing.

RE Daniel (see archive): Your axe head may not be capable of breaking through a roof, but if it were hit by a spinner then it could. A tether minimises that risk as much as possible.

[ady]

FRA urgent announcement

this is what i agree with simon, my 7 year old daughter will be at events so to me spectator safety is MY top priority, but also we need to come up with a not so hasty solution. If this isnt carried out correctly then i believe you will jepordise the future of the sport, we can all talk about membership costs etc.... but we all have costs we incur, whether its building a machine, paying for repairs after battles, travelling to events, booking rooms... we could go on and on. lets not move off the discussion in question otherwise it will never get resolved. its answers to the problem we need to find.

sorry about the spelling!!

[geeza]

FRA urgent announcement

Simon from recent events we know that shrapnel can fly up just as easily from a horizontal spinner as a vertical one. My feather is in the process of having a improved vertical drum on which I will only be allowed to run at Robochallenge events until things change. This is the least of my worries and should also be the same for everyone. Nobody wants an accident to happen, it would put an end to our fun possibly forever.

[grant_ploughbot]

FRA urgent announcement

Simon : The things is that its just as likley for a horizontal spinner to throw objects or teeth towards the roof. Infact, thats exactly what happened at the UK Championships with Scorpion. This is a very tricky solution to find, and for now I fully back the FRA/event organisers decisions to ban spinners unless the new guildlines are followed.

It is also not un-common for spinners teeth to become seperated from its disc or bar. Only a couple of weeks ago Little spinners thick titanium bar snapped off when it hit a hardox robot, and not so long ago scorpion Jnrs teeth came off after the bolts were cut off by another spinner.

[simon]

FRA urgent announcement

Im not suggesting my post would solve all ills, they where just discussion points or examples.
Where any hazard exists there are controll measures that can be put in place to minimise RISK. No matter what you do there will always be a RISK, but there must with some thinking be a way to keep this minimal without the need for the total banning of a particular type of bot.
I was not looking for an arguement, there has been enough in this thread already, this is just divisive and solves bugger all.
As strange as this may seem how about people post any thoughts as daft as they may seem on the forum. A brain storming session if you like. Its supriseing how the most crazy idea with some modification can prove to be a solution.

[simon]

FRA urgent announcement

YIKES !!! That was deep. I need to sleep now

[maddox]

FRA urgent announcement

Mario to answer your question from how I see things. If an event organiser were to ignore guidelines then it could be taken that either the event organiser or the roboteer who caused an accident could be liable for damages. Assuming that they neglected to inform the insurance comapny of what they were doing.


At last a sensible and direct answer. Thanks Ed.

Legaly seen
The FRA can advice as much as it want. Nobody is mandated to listen or obey.

For events,

If an idiot organizes an event doesnt know what hes doing and gets an insurance compagny to insure his event ,then he is insured.
Even if he gets 2 spinners to fight in the crowd...

But if a knowledgable person organizes a perfect event, and even the tiniest bit goes wrong then hes not insured and will lose any lawsuit leveled against him.

[bex]

FRA urgent announcement

Careful now Mario. That was my point last night and I think James. It would be a shame for this to end the sport and cause conflicts.
post 1070 of unpayed member

[Guest]

FRA urgent announcement

RE Ed (see archive): So this tether thing is only if my weapon clashes with a spinner. But if there arnt any spinners I wont need the tether.
Also I am having touble trying to come up with a way to make a tether that could survive if the axe is damaged by a spinner. Anything the rips the axe from the robot will more then likely rip the tether off too. I have a one peice blade that I some times use for an axe, which is directly attached to the axial. The only way to rip it out of the robot is to remove half the robot with it. A tether in this case seems useless, just another reason to add weight to a robot.
I am more likely to have my armor and wheels ripped off by a spinner, should I be tethering them aswell?
I understand some people might be only concerned with an axe on spinner clash, but dont we a) design for that so of impact, I do which is why I have the one peice blade, and b) youve just banned spinners, so why hinder axes as well?

How about a simple solution. We make is compulsery that spinners have to tether their teeth.

[james...venom]

FRA urgent announcement

Let me just say that the new guidlines havent been hastley put together. As andy said they have been worked on ever scince the UK Champs.

The thing is its not just a little risky to run events to the old standard, but highly risky to the point we are very lucky somebody hasnt got seriously hurt or killed. Thats fact.
These new guildlines are extremely important and all agreed, they needed to be in place immediately

[grant_ploughbot]

FRA urgent announcement

Daniel - Im not sure about having a tether if the axe is made from a single peice so its probably best to e-mail the FRA about that. But when there is a seperate axe head it is a possibility the the head can come off and be thrown toward the roof.