How Could I Improve...

[alex_holt]

How Could I Improve...

Thats only if you want them really exposed (although may I also add, one of the main benefits of tracks is that they are more suited to invertible robots due to the ability to wrap round an irregular shape) but that if flipper the area that would normally just be armour between the front and rear wheels is now also somewhere to be attacked.

[davids]

How Could I Improve...

Lets separate tracked robots into 2 areas:
1 - 101 style tracks on the outside of the machine
2 - Tracks on the inside of the machine protected by the armour.

Im with Aaron, that extra 10KG bonus over wheeled machines isnt making it a level playing field.

(Message edited by DavidS on March 26, 200

[joey_picus]

How Could I Improve...

So basically invertible and non invertible tracked machines?

[kodster]

How Could I Improve...

Whatever. Future Super Gore and Macduff incarnations may follow this rule in the future, but for now, Im keeping my stats the way they are. :P

[knightrous]

How Could I Improve...

quote:

As to the tracks rule, I believe I was either the first to pitch it or the first to use it - I forget which.... anyway, there were and are several reasons:

Firstly, no one uses tracks, it was a way of encouraging more.

Secondly in vapourbots, however much exposed wheels arent treated fairly, tracks have traditionally had it twice as bad through merit that they need to be pretty exposed to function, so in my view the weight is justified.

Thirdly they are heavier, and there is more to go wrong. Also, bear in mind that they do not necessarily get better traction - in a wheeled bot the traction is improved because the weight is focused into a smaller area, by increasing the area you gain increased friction but decreased force per square inch against the ground (I think anyway)

Shall we give out 10KG bonus to bots painted red? Not many of them around these days... If you want more of an array of different designs or unusual systems, just ban spinners... 10KG extra weight is crap compensation compared to knowing youll never have to fight a spinner.

The other reason I dont like the idea of providing extra weight for tracks is because it is far too easy to build a track system that is light, and functions like a wheeled robot with the tracks torn off. Same with shufflers, easy to build a lightweight setup near the same as wheels and score extra weight, it just screams exploit...

My opinion anyway.

[alex_holt]

How Could I Improve...

The difference being that to paint a robot red doesnt mean it weighs more or needs to allocate propertionally more weight to a specifically aspect of the design

I dont think 10kg is enough to unbalance a robot really - you could do light tracks, but in doing so you end up with something so flimsy youd be better off leaving the 10kg bonus and just havign wheels for the trouble it causes.

Perhaps when there is a tracked vapour out there that is managing to abuse the weight then Ill review my own policies, but as no one has managed to do it yet I dont see any reason to change it.

[knightrous]

How Could I Improve...

quote:

Perhaps when there is a tracked vapour out there that is managing to abuse the weight then Ill review my own policies, but as no one has managed to do it yet I dont see any reason to change it. Is that a challenge or what

Its so easy its not funny, take a standard 4WD robot, carve a v-belt groove into the treads, put a v-belt between the wheels... You now have a rubber tracked robot, that if the tracks are to break, affect the drive in no way. Probably 1-2KG to build it, and you get a bonus of 10kg to bolt in another LEM130 for that spinning disc or put a nice big 120mm bore 100mm stroke ram for a flipper.

You could always get technical on policing this, but the requirements would be a waste of time as half the people now cant provide enough information on batteries let alone explaining they have a 85 segment track, with road wheels and suspension based on T70 tank...

[alex_holt]

How Could I Improve...

It was meant as a challenge, lol. The first thing I note with that is a rubber belt would probably be inclined to tangle around the inside wheels when (not if) it broke and generally jar up your whole drive train.

Alternately perhaps the weight limit would only apply to segemented tracks rather than giant rubber bands.

[leorcc]

How Could I Improve...

When Storm II smashed Supernova into the thread of Killalot, that track came clean of, no jamming or anything.

[joey_picus]

How Could I Improve...

Didnt the front two rollers come off as well?

[alex_holt]

How Could I Improve...

Killalot has external tracks, Aaron seemed to be discussing ones housed within the chassis from what I understood, if they are external then they are exposed anyway.

[andrewj]

How Could I Improve...

Does it really matter where the tracks are? Tracks are tracks, internal or external. Tracks are getting a 10% addition to the weight because people feel sorry for the lack of them. As Aaron quite rightly said, by that logic, next we will be giving out weight bonuses to various paint colours! If tracks are too heavy well then thats just too damn bad. Examples have already been given how to make a tracked set up within a few kilos (if that). Who actually uses the weight bonus for the tracks rather than having more armour or having a bigger weapon? Choosing to have a tracked robot provides its advantages and disadvantages. Being heavier certainly does not require a weight bonus, thats a sacrifice you have to make, for say, additional traction. I want some LEM200 motors for my robot, but they are too heavy. Can I have a weight bonus? Yeah... you get the idea.

[corsair_lightning]

How Could I Improve...

New Cyrilium:

Cyrilium 2
Shape: All Torque (Series 2)
Colour: Gold with a silver stripe down the middle.
Weight: 110kg
Dimensions: 70cm x 30cm x 12cm
Speed: 20mph
Turning Circle: 0mm
Ground Clearance: 0mm at the front, and 5mm everywhere else.
Armour: 5mm titanium
Movement: Titanium tank tracks put inside the robot.
Power: 2 E-Teks powered by a USA Interstate Batteries R34 24V car battery.
Weapons: 750psi rear hinged flipper mounted on the front, and a 30kg titanium flywheel on the back.
Srimech: Flipper.
Notes: Entirely new robot.
Strengths: resilient, good weapons.
Weaknesses: I dont know of any, yet.

[joey_picus]

How Could I Improve...

Probably not a good idea to put in tracks in the middle of The Great Tracks Debate

The dimensions could do with enlarging a bit, and some more information for the weapons would be good, like how many flips the flipper has, and a Kj count for the flywheel. One more thing; Eteks arent actually that good for drive, ask Craig. Otherwise, it actually looks good, if a little vague, but definitely an improvement over the last one.

[corsair_lightning]

How Could I Improve...

The Flipper has 30 flips, while the flywheel spins at 150kjs.