Pneumatic questions, sorry!

[Max]

I am just starting to think about my next robot and like the idea of a featherweight pneumatic flipper. I have read through a lot of the old threads but am still left with some questions. I still don't understand what the stroke and the bore mean? Also I remember seeing a link to a great website on pneumatics in combat robotics but I can't find the link, does anyone know what it was? I was also wondering if you realy need a buffer tank because due to my design i can only fit in either 1 main tank and 1 buffertank or 2 main tanks which i think i will need to get plenty of flips(i am thinking of
Using p16oz paint ball gun bottles) I am sure that more questions will follow soon but thanks for now.

[Laser]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

Stroke = how much the ram goes up and down
Bore = what the diametre of the inside of the cylinder is.
website = http://www.teamonslaught.fsnet.co.uk/co2_info.htm
go to an event ask around about pneumatics, thats how I learnt

[billy breach]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

I think stroke - is the travel distance of the piston
I think the Bore is the diameter of the cylinder - this is important for working the power of your flipper etc.
I would say a buffer tank is needed as it will feed your 5/2 valve quickly and allow your piston to stroke.

LINK http://www.teamdavinci.com/understanding_pneumatics.htm

edit - someone can type faster than me

[Max]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

Thanks for the super quick responses guys! Both of those websites look great i will have a look at them tonight. Another couple of questions, what's the difference between an fp and a hp system. Also if you are using fb am I right in thinking that you don't need a regulator?

[Laser]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

Another couple of questions, what's the difference between an fp and a hp system.]

Nothing they are both the same.

Also if you are using fb am I right in thinking that you don't need a regulator?

Yes you are right.

Also you may want to bear this in mind, these pressure levels (fp) are very high which are very dangerous.
Its best to start off with low pressure (LP) and then work your way up.

[Max]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

Sorry even more questions, if I was using a fp system then would I need a buffer tank as all the pressure is released instantly (no regulator)?

[Laser]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

Yes.

[Anttazz]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

I'm not the best to answer questions about pneumatics, but don't think you would NEED one, but it would help.

[Mouldy]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

Ideally the volume of your buffer should be atleast 3 times the volume of your pneumatic cylinder

[maddox10]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

I am just starting to think about my next robot and like the idea of a featherweight pneumatic flipper.

Great, Join the Club.

I have read through a lot of the old threads but am still left with some questions.

Who doesn't?

I still don't understand what the stroke and the bore mean?

Like in combustion engines, bore and stroke are what make up the volume in a cylinder.
Stroke is the distance the piston can travel. Bore is the diameter of the piston (and that is the same as the bore -minus a few 100th of a mm- of the cylinder it travels in). Diameter dictates the surface area. In case of a normal cylinder that is Radius (half diameter) * Radius * Pi (3.14 to be fast).
Surface of piston in cm² * pressure in bar = force in kg.

Also I remember seeing a link to a great website on pneumatics in combat robotics but I can't find the link, does anyone know what it was?

Several websites qualify in that respect.
But for Robot Wars, I have posted these in the past
http://www.dutchrobotgames.nl/index.php ... &Itemid=70
http://www.teamonslaught.fsnet.co.uk/pneumatics.htm

I was also wondering if you really need a buffer tank because due to my design i can only fit in either 1 main tank and 1 buffertank or 2 main tanks which i think i will need to get plenty of flips(i am thinking of
Using p16oz paint ball gun bottles)

Hannibalito III uses a Full Pressure setup, Cutlet/Gravity style with 12 oz main bottle and a buffertank, still we achive 15 flips or better. Amount of flips depends on stored CO2 and volume of cylinder.
I doubt that there is any feather using 32oz CO2.
An option is to use a 16 or 20 oz main bottle and a reasonable buffertank. I aim for 3 times cylindervolume in the buffertank.

I am sure that more questions will follow soon but thanks for now.

Please do.

[Max]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

Hi again and thanks for the replies. Just wondered what size rams most people use in feathers and how much force they try to get at the tip of the flipper arm(after leverage)? Also how far does the tip of most flipper arms move to get a decent flip?

[Max]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

could i use this ram:
https://www.easupplies.com/SPEEDAIRE-MD ... pn1eg1.htm ?
i would be using it at 10 bar.
i would put in a diagram but dont know how

[Max]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

here is the diagram:

or if that doesn't work it's on here:
http://fightingrobotpics.webs.com/apps/ ... =132027416

[typhoon_driver]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

I'm not expert on pneumatics but I'll tell you that the ram you have there is far too small to be of much use in a featherweight. If you are looking for a low pressure ram (up to 16 bar), I have one kicking around 50mm bore, 100mm stroke for 25 quid plus postage. PM if interested.

[maddox10]

Re: Pneumatic questions, sorry!

Hmm, how to tell this.

Tip force.
FP is a kind of speciality of me.
I'm happy with Hannibalito III. Ram is 51mm bore *85mm stroke, leverage 3.5 to 1.
This means, theoretical, 2.505*2.501*pi*55=1083 kg of force , with a tip power of 310 kg over 300mm.

Hannibalito I was on the low end according to me. 32mm *bore 80mm stroke. Leverage 3 to 1.
150kg tip force, over 240mm

A LP 50*45 ram, with a leverage of 1 to 1 gives you 150 kg over 45mm. (less than a fifth of the smaller FP ram of Hannibalito I)